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Curious in Virginia
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Posted: Thu Apr 21st, 2005 07:20 pm |
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I was wondering if we could post an expected Salary for many who are finishing up the ARE. One thing that we rarely hear about is how much salary an architect is expected. Why should there be so much guess work?
I worked from 2001- 2005 in North Carolina my starting salary began at $15/ hour approx. $28,800 per year. Currently I'm getting paid $20/ hour approx $38,400.
I have my 5-year professional degree and am taking the exam now. I have about 5 years experience. Does anyone have any salary numbers for Virginia, since I will be moving to Richmond when I complete my exam and will be looking for a new job.
Please post you salaries and info. for others to read. Lets make architects salary as public info. as any other profession. Maybe then and only then we will begin to see a change.
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teklhammer
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Posted: Fri Apr 22nd, 2005 12:47 am |
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Good subject!
My salary is right in line with what http://www.monster.com basic salary report (freebie) says for an Architect IV...benefits too! I think it is a fair tool to use to get an idea of what is fair in your area. When choosing what level 'Architect' you are, try to choose the level that best describes what you do...not what you want to, or can do.
Last edited on Sat Apr 30th, 2005 02:19 pm by teklhammer
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Five Years
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Posted: Fri Apr 22nd, 2005 01:28 am |
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| I am from the California and have a Bachelor of Arts, Master of Architecture and 5 years of work experience with a current salary of $45,000 plus paid health benefits, but no retirement benefits or profit sharing. I know for a fact that my salary is on the lower side comparing to my fellow classmates graduated from the same year. Hearing from difference sources, it sound like getting a higher salary is not only depending of the nature of your job responsibilities, but how the company. People I know that switch from job to job ended up with a higher pay and more job responsibilities. That makes me wonder why people where company loyalty is.
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bruceprice
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Posted: Fri Apr 22nd, 2005 03:25 pm |
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MArch 2001, finished IDP in 2004 and I'm currently working towards my license:
JOB 1 summer 1997- $10/hr
JOB 2 summer 1999- $10/hr
summer 2000- $12.50/hr
summer 2001- $16/hr
JOB 3 2001- $40k, no benefits
2002- $40k, no benefits
2003- $40k, health insurance
2004- $50k, health insurance, $500 (gee, thanks) bonus
-Jobs 1 & 3 are in NYC, and Job 2 was in the 'burbs
-Job 1 was a huge international firm and Jobs 2 & 3 are single family residential
I plan to ask for a raise when I finish the ARE process- hopely to the 55-60k range. My plan of attack is to ask if my boss will bill more for my hours once I'm licensed. If he raises my billing rate from $80 up to $100/hr, for example, then he's billing as much as 40k more a year for my time- and I figure I'm entitled to a good chunk of that.
ps- My brother is 5 years younger than me (he graduated from college in 2003) and works as an elementary school teacher. he has a bachelors degree but no other training or credentials... and he makes more money per hour than I do. He makes more money annually also by supplementing his teachers' income with 2 hrs of tutoring per week and a few hrs/wk over the summer... Ask the general public, though, and they'll tell you that architects are rich and teachers are woefully underpaid.
Last edited on Thu Apr 28th, 2005 11:13 pm by bruceprice
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ColdLamper
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Posted: Fri Apr 22nd, 2005 03:54 pm |
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bruceprice wrote: 50k + health insurance in New York City w/ a masters degree and 4 years of experience. small residential firm. I think that this is probably avg. to slightly above average... and it's barely enough to get by in nyc. (I pay 5-10k more a year for rent than I would in most parts of the country.)
I plan to ask for a raise when I finish the ARE process- hopely to the 55-60k range. My plan of attack is to ask if my boss will bill more for my hours once I'm licensed. If he raises my billing rate from $80 up to $100/hr, for example, then he's billing as much as 40k more a year for my time- and I figure I'm entitled to a good chunk of that. (now that I think about it, if he starts billing $100 hour, I want more than 60k- thanks for making me think about this!)
My approach will be very similar, except I am going to approach it with the idea of my salary increase being based on what percentage my billable rate is increasing (about 20%). I am currently making $20 / hour, so I figure to be around $24 / hour when it's all said and done. Seems fair to me.
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pinoy rktx
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Posted: Fri Apr 22nd, 2005 04:23 pm |
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| The best way of checking if you are getting paid appropriately with respect to your billing rate is to divide your billing rate by 3. You should then be around that hourly figure. For example, if you learn that your time is being billed at 75 per hour, then it is fair to give you 25 per hour or 52,000 per year. The rest of the 50 per hour excess goes to company overhead, though some of it still goes back to you in terms of 401K contributions, bonuses, etc.
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Kevin67
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Posted: Fri Apr 22nd, 2005 06:05 pm |
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That's an ok rule of thumb, but realistically the multiplier can be anywhere from 1.5 to more than 5. It depends almost entirely on the specific firm's overhead which can be affected by all sorts of factors: rent, insurance, number of non-billable staff (like office managers, accountants, IT managers, marketing dept., graphic designers, etc.) that need to be "carried" in the billable rates of others, etc. etc.
I am currently a sr. associate in a small firm (with corresponding very low overhead) and my multiplier is less than 2. At one point previously, as a inten/job captain for a very large firm in a major metropolitan region, my multiplier was around 5.
To pick a random multiplier out of the air without knowing the specifics of the firm may only lead to frustration without understanding the firm's full financial picture.
Remember that from your billable hours the firm must pay for equipment, software, light bulbs, coffee, company cars, insurance (errors and omissions, property, auto, employee theft, etc.), all non-billable hours spent in travel, training, internal meetings, etc,, all office utilities, communications, taxes of all sorts, health insurance and other benefits, registration and professional fees, unemploymnet insurance, workers' comp, and so on and so forth
Remember (from your studying?) that the average amount of profit of the total of billings is only about 8% to 9%.
Most firms I've been with haven't automatically raised billing rates for employees when they get registered. Billing rates are usually based on the person's position in the firm, which is not necessarily tied to credentials. In my firm we bill a higher rate for Associates than for Project Designers - but it is possible to be an Associate without being registered, and possible to be registered and not be an Associate....
Last edited on Sun May 28th, 2006 03:20 am by Kevin67
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bruceprice
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Posted: Fri Apr 22nd, 2005 06:41 pm |
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My boss has very little overhead- he has no aministrative staff, no rent (we work from his home- and he can actually deduct part of his maintenance as a business cost,) very little travel, very old office equipment, no bonuses and few perks beyond health insurance- though he does have insurance for the business.
I may be wrong but I would guess that overhead represents not much more than 10% of what he bills for my time- as opposed to the 50+% you'd find in many firms. He pays me 30% which, if I'm not leaving anyting out, leaves 60% for profit on my time. So I think he has a much higher profit margin than typical. And I don't blame him at all- the alternative would be paying me significantly higher than market rates or billing clients significantly lower. He's running a business not a charity.
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O
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Posted: Fri Apr 22nd, 2005 07:03 pm |
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Bruceprice
I hope you are getting a high salary because your logic does not follow through. He is not paying office space, which others pay from $10 to $20 per square foot that is a huge overhead. This is not a matter of charity is a matter of fairness.
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Kevin67
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Posted: Fri Apr 22nd, 2005 07:07 pm |
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bruceprice: you have to remember that whatever your salary is you actually cost your employer 120% of that (in other words your salary plus another 20% of your salary) just to pay you. This is because of payroll taxes, unemployment insurance, social security and medicare, and worker's comp. This doesn't even include health insurance. For example, an employee who is paid 42k actually costs the firm about 50k to employ - not including benefits!
Also, if you take any sick days or vacation or paid holidays these are also being "subsidized" by the billable rate, because these are hours for which you're paid but aren't doing billable work.
Also, are you 100% productive? This would be extremely unusual. Most firms use a target of 80% to 90% billable hours for "production staff" whereas an owner/principal's time could be anywhere from 0% to 80% or 90% billable, depending on his role in the firm (a principal who spends nearly all his time on marketing will bill almost no hours and his time will be completely carried by his employees' billings, while a sole proprietor will usually bill somewhere in the 50% to 80% range of his time, and some principals have as much (or greater) of a production role as their employees, so may bill 90% - but this still leaves the 10% or more for phone time, preparing contracts and invoices, meeting with potential new clients, even cleaning up around the office....
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bruceprice
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Posted: Fri Apr 22nd, 2005 07:57 pm |
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Thanks Kevin. These are all taxes and other factors that I don't know much about but will have to learn for when I start my business- though I plan to be a sole proprietor for the first several years.
As for productivity- I put 8 hours a day on my time sheet no matter how productive I am (i.e. someone is getting billed for my internet time right now) but I think my boss often chooses, in an intuitive rather than scientific, to bill clients for various fractions of the time that is on my time sheet.
I definitely underestimated the amount of overhead that my boss has- but without a doubt he has fewer expenses than most architects and a higher profit margin.
O- I definitely wouldn't refuse a raise in pay for the reason that my boss doesn't have to pay rent- and I'm sure our clients would be more than willing to pay a lower fee. But I don't think my boss is being unfair. He pays a fair wage and bills a fair rate and shouldn't have to change that just because he's structured his business efficiently. I don't think I should get paid more than the average intern architect just because I work in a home office instead of a commercial office building. I wish my boss agreed with you though.
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guest
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Posted: Mon Apr 25th, 2005 06:59 pm |
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Back to salary numbers, I think it's so important that we share these numbers. I feel at such a huge disadvantage not knowing what to expect. I think the recent economy has left a lot of young architects and interns severly underpaid. On a side note I find it incredibly annoying that salary reports are sold for a fee.
I am a very recently registered architect in minneapolis. I have a BArch and 3 years post-college experience. I've been at two firms in the last 3 years and made $15/hour at both. (with OT $31,000 a year) I got a 26% raise last week and now I'm salaried at $40,000 a year. I think the owners realized that with my license in hand I'd be willing to leave in a heartbeat for a larger salary. I'm still not sure if I'm being paid fairly for the market I'm in, but I've got to be closer than I was a week ago.
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EAB
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Posted: Mon Apr 25th, 2005 07:48 pm |
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Guest,
Check out the tread Is it what you expected? http://www.areforum.org/forums/forum16/3700.html
Both Johnny-i and Kevin67 wrote some insightful information about raises and why owners of firms would consider adminstering raises or promotions.
This is a great forum to learn about the architecture profession, I wish you luck in your career...
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jens
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Posted: Tue Apr 26th, 2005 12:05 am |
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| You can also check out http://www.salary.com to find out what is the average salary in your area. The information includes a base salary range and a salary with benefits range. Hope this helps.
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artichoke
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Posted: Tue Apr 26th, 2005 12:45 am |
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Barch 98'
Licensed
55K
Connecticut
and some great points Kevin.
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tect75
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Posted: Tue Apr 26th, 2005 02:53 pm |
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Barch 99
50K,health, dental, retirement
New Jersey
no license
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iwo
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Posted: Tue Apr 26th, 2005 08:40 pm |
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my record... in a major city. all small firms less than 10 people.
Job 1
- 97 - $12/hr
- 98 - $33k base + $1k bonus + 50% insurance
Job 2
- 99 - $36k base + $2.5k bonus +100% insurance
- 00 - $39k base + $3k bonus + 401k + 100% insurance
- 01 - $42k base + $3k bonus + 401k + 100% insurance
- 02 - $55k base + $1k bonus + 100% insurance
Job 3
- 03 - $56k base + $3k bonus + 75% insurance
- 04 - $56k base + $4kbonus + 75% insurance
- 05 - $62k base + ???
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iwo
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Posted: Tue Apr 26th, 2005 08:42 pm |
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whoops... 02 is job 3.
03, 04, 05 are all job 4.
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Aglaia
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Posted: Wed Apr 27th, 2005 05:55 am |
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| (Update: This thread has gotten long and spanning well over a year. I posted an update in September 2006 that is more up-to-date than what I had orinally posted here). Last edited on Mon Sep 25th, 2006 03:07 am by Aglaia
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Guest
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Posted: Thu Apr 28th, 2005 10:41 pm |
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I just checked this topic and as of 04/28/05 there have been 513 different users read this post. OK, this is for all the slackers who read these salary posts and don't reply. You are also (probably) the ones who complain about your salary every chance you get.
So... if you want to make a difference post your salary, location, and amount of experience right now. If you were curious enough to read the postings, why not take a second to respond with your information? It only takes a second.
We have taken the time to write our information to share it with you... so why can't you share your information with us? We're all in the same boat. So why not help out?
Many THANKS
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Guest
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Posted: Thu Apr 28th, 2005 10:47 pm |
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Out of the 513 users only 18 people have responded. Thanks goes out to all of you who have responded. Out of those 18 users who have responded we have maybe 10 who have posted salaries.
The websites are useful, but not very accurate according to location, experience, and Licensure. I tried the websites for different locations and got the same salary figures.
Thanks again
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guest
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Posted: Thu Apr 28th, 2005 11:04 pm |
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Northeast OH (Job #1)
'98 - $27k (first job after graduation w/ B.Arch)
'99 - $33k (no bonus)
Southern CA (Job #2)
'00 - $44k + $2k bonus
'01 - $49k (no bonus)
(Job #3)
'02 - $54k (I think  )
(Job #4)
'03 - $53.5k +$2k bonus
(Job #5)
'04-Current - $53k +$3k bonus
Hmmm...looking at this, I'm not following a very good trend. Still waiting for my review for the year, so we'll see if any raise is in the wings.
All jobs had about 80% healthcare paid by employer and small match on 401k.
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mohull
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Posted: Thu Apr 28th, 2005 11:29 pm |
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current job is the first job i've stuck w/ for over a year. most of the others have been hourly varying from 10 during summers in college to 16/hr for a really crappy job that i stayed only 8wks. i like this office, and they're really supportive (maybe not financially but i guess you could say 'emotionally') w/ regard to getting licensed.
interested parties should also check out http://www.archinect.com/salary_questionnaire/index.php
you have to join to participate and view, but its fairly interesting, and much like this thread. the site is pretty good in general, so you may want to join anyways.
also, check http://www.insidearch.org/home.php it's a great resource, and will work better and better as more people complete firm profiles.
oh, and i haven't finished the ARE yet.
Last edited on Sat Apr 30th, 2005 03:30 am by mohull
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mohull
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Posted: Thu Apr 28th, 2005 11:40 pm |
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| also, guest who started this topic, may i ask why you're not registered with the forum?
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40five
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Posted: Fri Apr 29th, 2005 05:36 pm |
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job 1, while in school, $12/hour
job 2, after graduation -
year 1 $35k/year, no health insurance, bonus
year 2 $40k/year, health insurance, 401k, bonus
year 3 $50k/year, health insurance, 401k, bonus
year 4 $57k/year, health insurance, 401k, bonus
Last edited on Fri Apr 29th, 2005 05:38 pm by 40five
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Alberti
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Posted: Fri Apr 29th, 2005 08:30 pm |
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When the lemmings jump......
During school in Chicago area (left owning audio company to become peon at local firm; what this profession does to you!)-
-start at $7 per hour and ended at $16
Afer graduating w/ M Arch moved to Southern Arizona (note that cost of living here is less than metro chicago)-
-$35k w/ benefits
-currently $42k w/ benefits and overtime (around $50k with that)
Told that after licence (3/4 done w ARE) will jump w/ salary, profit share and added benefits. Even with this still tempting to start on own
Last edited on Fri Apr 29th, 2005 08:34 pm by Alberti
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Scully504
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Posted: Fri Apr 29th, 2005 09:22 pm |
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| I have to be honest that I was uncomfortable responding to this post because the originator was asking me to post personal information yet is logged on anonymously as a guest.
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LD in NYC
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Posted: Fri Apr 29th, 2005 09:39 pm |
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Ok here goes...
Graduation June '94
Job 1: July 94 to Nov. 94 - $33K Junior Architect (NYC)
Job 2: Dec 94 to June 96 - $26k Junior Architect (NYC)
Job 3: June 96 to June 97 - $40k Junior Architect (NYC)
Job 4: June 97 to June 99 - $50k Project Architect (NYC)
Job 5: June 99 to May 00 - $55k Architectural Consultant (NYC)
Job 6: May 00 to Oct 01 - $72k Architectural Consultant (Sept 11) (NYC)
Job 7: Dec 01 to Oct 02 - $60k Project Manager (LI, NY)
Job 8: Nov 02 to Jan 05 - $50k Project Manager - Licensed Jan 05 - Raise - $61k (NJ)
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iwo
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Posted: Fri Apr 29th, 2005 10:03 pm |
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kinda whacky to see that most people are topping out at $60-$70k.
i met some computer geek who just got out of school and is making that for servicing computers and playing internet games all day long. btw, he also wears white tube socks with boat shoes and khakis. and carries his blackberry on a holster off his braided belt.
sickens me... really sickens me.
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afedor
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Posted: Fri Apr 29th, 2005 10:44 pm |
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| Yeah, IWO, we're all just suckers. Last edited on Mon May 2nd, 2005 07:17 pm by afedor
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Kevinjc2
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Posted: Sun May 1st, 2005 03:27 am |
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1997-1999 Attending Technical College for Arch. Drafting. Worked at large firm doing basic office task.........$10.00 per hour.........no benefits
1999-2002 After Graduation switched to another large firm. Title was architectural cad design (cad monkey)...........$12.00 per hour...........excellent benefits, and huge bonus, plus profit sharing
2002-2003 Moved to pursue architecture degree. Switched jobs a couple of times ranging from engineering firms to electrical firms............$14.50 per hour
2003-present Took job at small firm doing large residential and some small comercial, also took over as lead drafter..........$17.00 per hour...........no benefits
Will be switching companies back to where I worked in 1999-2002. Will have more responsiblities................$17.50 per hour..........excellent benefits, and huge bonus, plus profit sharing.
I also currently only have an Associates degree in Arch. Drafting and after attending Architectural school, feel that unless I went to another state I am not really rece |
