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NOOR
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Posted: Wed Sep 10th, 2008 05:01 pm |
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| If you have exterior tile finish ona building (tile size is 12"x24") do you still need control joints? If yes, what is teh criteria for spacing and what kind of joint filler is used?
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Coach
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Posted: Wed Sep 10th, 2008 05:50 pm |
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It would be a good idea to put them at the same location as the underlying concrete joints.
There are sealants for that application. I've also seen inserts that accept grout.
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brudgers
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Posted: Thu Sep 11th, 2008 04:31 am |
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| What does the manufacturer recommend?
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cganiere
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Posted: Thu Sep 11th, 2008 03:20 pm |
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NOOR wrote:
If you have exterior tile finish ona building (tile size is 12"x24") do you still need control joints? If yes, what is teh criteria for spacing and what kind of joint filler is used?
Yes. If the sun will hit the tile it will expand. Check out the Tile Council of America (TCA) for their recommendations.
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stl-guy
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Posted: Fri Sep 12th, 2008 05:07 am |
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NOOR wrote: If you have exterior tile finish ona building (tile size is 12"x24") do you still need control joints? If yes, what is teh criteria for spacing and what kind of joint filler is used?
Expansion joints and control joints are not the same.
You will definitely need soft expansion joints for most ceramic, clay or silica type tiles. While less porous than brick, most tile will expand while masonry back-up such as CMU will contract, thus requiring control joints and intervals recommended by ASTM and or the manufacturer. Joints can be engineered or sometimes by empericial methods depending on importance.
The back-up substrate may or may not need control joints depending on the material except for interior finishes. If the substrate is masonry, It is best to design expansion and control joints at the same locations.
Take care to also design horizontal joints at shelf angles, etc.
Last edited on Fri Sep 12th, 2008 05:19 am by stl-guy
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NOOR
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Posted: Wed Sep 17th, 2008 06:01 am |
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| These would be thinset tiles over framed wall. They are less than 1/2" thick.
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stl-guy
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Posted: Thu Sep 18th, 2008 01:12 am |
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NOOR wrote: These would be thinset tiles over framed wall. They are less than 1/2" thick.
Ceramic tile is used extensively in Europe as exterior finish. I did an 800,00 sq. ft. five story building in the Midwest using ceramic tile for cladding. The tiles were only 6" x 6". Tile can and does work. Even though not used extensively in the US, it will hold up. Joints though do to need to be engineered for a successful job. I would think that soft joints at intervals of about 20' on center will allow for some expansion.
Do speak th the tile Council and ask for recommendations.
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dudeman
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Posted: Sat Sep 27th, 2008 07:43 pm |
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stl-guy:
Can you explain the purpose of horizontal joints at shelf angles? Also what is the general rule/ distance for locating expansion joints with masonry?
would appreciate any help with this issue?
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stl-guy
Architect
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Posted: Sun Sep 28th, 2008 05:04 pm |
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dudeman wrote: stl-guy:
Can you explain the purpose of horizontal joints at shelf angles? Also what is the general rule/ distance for locating expansion joints with masonry?
would appreciate any help with this issue?
Brick expands and contracts with changes in temperature and moisture content. Relieving (shelf) angles are necessary to ensure that movement is accommodated between face brick and back-up wall systems, and that cracks and displacement attributable to restraint in the system are alleviated. Soft joints installed at horizontal (shelf) angles, and at vertical control and expansion joints, will accommodate movement and create relief for the brick’s expansion.
Expansion joints in brick masonry cavity or rain-screen walls can be engineered or by empirical design in accordance with 530/ASCE and are generally installed at about 20' o.c., where walls change direction, usually near wall corners and at shelf angles.
In order to prevent distress in the masonry, vertical and horizontal expansion joints are used to accommodate movements. No single recommendation for the positioning and spacing of vertical and horizontal expansion joints can be applicable to all structures. Each building must be analyzed to determine the potential movements, and provisions must be made to permit such movement or to resist stresses resulting from such movements. Expansion joints must also be designed, located and constructed so not to impair the integrity of the wall.
Last edited on Sun Sep 28th, 2008 05:21 pm by stl-guy
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